Opening day Highlights vs Preston

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stainrod's elbow
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Re: Opening day Highlights vs Preston

Post by stainrod's elbow » Sun Aug 05, 2018 7:55 pm

UxbridgeR wrote:
Sun Aug 05, 2018 10:14 am
stainrod's elbow wrote:
Sat Aug 04, 2018 8:16 pm
If that grim little reel is in any way representative, it looks like we were out-thought, out-fought, and out-played pretty much from start to finish. Smith's header was about it, while Sylla, held or not, should be scoring from that range. And their goal (they all count, by the way) just makes our goalie look like a ball-watching schoolboy, topped off by Luongo's embarrassing pogo on the goal line.

I couldn't be there, and I feel for those who were.

'There may be trouble ahead . . .'

You got all that from less than two minutes of highlights ? Laughable.
O please try to read properly - or go back to school to learn! 'IF. THAT. GRIM. REEL. IS. IN. ANY. WAY. . . .' - on second thoughts, never mind!
"There's a blue light/in my best friend's room" -Mazzy Star

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Re: Opening day Highlights vs Preston

Post by stainrod's elbow » Sun Aug 05, 2018 7:59 pm

kernowhoop wrote:
Sun Aug 05, 2018 6:19 am
A 1-0 defeat at Preston is not the end of the world, but, the way that it happened raises a few questions.
I expected a better outcome. In my little dream world, I imagined that Eze and Osayi-Samuel (Freeman, too?) would be taking on Preston defenders in the way that they did against Union Berlin. I also thought that, after a while, they would get chopped down and we would benefit from free-kicks. I have no doubt that there is great talent in those players, so, the question is 'Why did they appear to present so little threat?' Steve McClaren seemed to allude to that after the game, when he talked of 'releasing the shackles'.
How do we 'release the shackles' ?
Good question! A question one might have hoped the manager and his coaching staff would have developed one or two pointers on in pre-season. Let's hope we can unbuckle for the Sheff. Utd game. Or will it be more whining about 'patience', 'inexperience' and ''it'll come'?
"There's a blue light/in my best friend's room" -Mazzy Star

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Re: Opening day Highlights vs Preston

Post by stainrod's elbow » Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:08 pm

Systemsguy wrote:
Sun Aug 05, 2018 3:23 pm
Looking forward to making my own mind up at around 5pm next Saturday....

There seems to be posters with an axe to grind over our current management setup and using a tough away game opener as a stick to beat them is laughable......

Anyone whose read my opinions over the last few years shows I'm no fan of Uncle Tony or Sez Les but I'm willing to offer all a clean slate as FFP is seemingly and finally sorted.... The punishment may or may not be fitting but it's done...

Let's move on and go again next Saturday...

Despite my opposition to Ollie's second sacking, I am actually very open-minded about the new manager, and will applaud any visible benefits he brings to the performances, but the proof of the pudding is and will be in the eating. When dm speaks of how we struggled to play out from the back to implement a (supposedly) 'key tactic' we worked on the whole summer, the obvious follow-up question he fails to ask is: if that is the case, why did it not show vs The Liliywhites apart from in the briefest flickers? Either enough work didn't go in, clearly, or we don't have the players to impose the plan, or the plan is flawed. (Or all three.)

I know . . . let's not hope for anything better, they're young players, actually winning against a big Northern side is nothing we should ever expect . . . aniwall
"There's a blue light/in my best friend's room" -Mazzy Star

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Re: Opening day Highlights vs Preston

Post by stainrod's elbow » Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:10 pm

stainrod's elbow wrote:
Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:08 pm
Systemsguy wrote:
Sun Aug 05, 2018 3:23 pm
Looking forward to making my own mind up at around 5pm next Saturday....

There seems to be posters with an axe to grind over our current management setup and using a tough away game opener as a stick to beat them is laughable......

Anyone whose read my opinions over the last few years shows I'm no fan of Uncle Tony or Sez Les but I'm willing to offer all a clean slate as FFP is seemingly and finally sorted.... The punishment may or may not be fitting but it's done...

Let's move on and go again next Saturday...
Despite my opposition to Ollie's second sacking, I am actually very open-minded about the new manager and will applaud any visible benefits he brings to the performances and gorge on humble pie till I'm sick, but the proof of said pudding is and will be in the eating. When dm speaks of how we struggled to play out from the back to implement a (supposedly) 'key tactic' we worked on the whole summer, the obvious follow-up question he fails to ask is (because I suspect he can't bear to): if that is the case, why did it not show vs The Lilywhites apart from in the briefest flickers? Either enough work didn't go in, clearly, or we don't have the players to impose the plan, or the plan is flawed. (Or all three.)

I know . . . let's not hope for anything better, they're young players, actually winning against a big Northern side is nothing we should ever expect, let's 'move on' . . . aniwall
"There's a blue light/in my best friend's room" -Mazzy Star

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Re: Opening day Highlights vs Preston

Post by Systemsguy » Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:35 pm

Your new McClaren "getting your excuses in early" post has decided for me I have no interest in continuing discussing any further QPR related matters with you....

:troll
2018/2019.... Keep Calm, no matter the season, we'll follow our team.....

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Re: Opening day Highlights vs Preston

Post by stainrod's elbow » Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:57 pm

Systemsguy wrote:
Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:35 pm
Your new McClaren "getting your excuses in early" post has decided for me I have no interest in continuing discussing any further QPR related matters with you....

:troll
I didn't even realise I was 'discussing matters with you' personally. I was doing what I hope everyone does here - speak, as an individual, for better or worse, which invariably means some people may be offended. What I will say is the idea that I or any other QPR supporter on this board is a 'troll' is also offensive, paranoid and an attempt to shut down - or at least - damage free speech. One or two people even agree with me, I'm sorry to remind you.

Some people need to grow up quickly (or, probably, slowly).
"There's a blue light/in my best friend's room" -Mazzy Star

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Re: Opening day Highlights vs Preston

Post by UxbridgeR » Sun Aug 05, 2018 9:43 pm

Systemsguy wrote:
Sun Aug 05, 2018 8:35 pm
Your new McClaren "getting your excuses in early" post has decided for me I have no interest in continuing discussing any further QPR related matters with you....

:troll
He posted that a full 13 minutes after claiming to be "very open-minded about the new manager".

Still, free speech, though......
Are headphones getting bigger, or are idiots getting smaller ?

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Re: Opening day Highlights vs Preston

Post by stainrod's elbow » Sun Aug 05, 2018 9:56 pm

13 is my lucky/unlucky number! A man can change his mind many times in 13 minutes! I'm just following the evidence - a worrying 10 minutes 'highlights' from Saturday's game, and now our manager's early season defeatism.
"There's a blue light/in my best friend's room" -Mazzy Star

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Re: Opening day Highlights vs Preston

Post by jimjams » Mon Aug 06, 2018 12:20 am

kernowhoop wrote:
Sun Aug 05, 2018 6:19 am
A 1-0 defeat at Preston is not the end of the world, but, the way that it happened raises a few questions.
I expected a better outcome. In my little dream world, I imagined that Eze and Osayi-Samuel (Freeman, too?) would be taking on Preston defenders in the way that they did against Union Berlin. I also thought that, after a while, they would get chopped down and we would benefit from free-kicks. I have no doubt that there is great talent in those players, so, the question is 'Why did they appear to present so little threat?' Steve McClaren seemed to allude to that after the game, when he talked of 'releasing the shackles'.
How do we 'release the shackles' ?
Well, I'll have a stab (ohers may disagree).

From clips it looks like Berlin played 442, which allows those players to find space in between the defence and midfield. Preston played a 4141, with Pearson up against Freeman. I thought Freeman played quite well, but the presence of Pearson meant he didn't have as much space and time on the ball, and also that it was more difficult for the players either side of him to link up with him. In addition, putting Pearson there meant the centrebacks can move back a bit more without having to worry too much about creating space between them and midfield. That means it's harder for Eze and Samuel to run in behind them, and easier for the full backs to push onto them, as the center of defence now has a spare man.
Then Luongo and Scowen have four men against them in midfield, which is normal (would be the same with a 442) but it's now harder for them to link with the players in front of them.
Essentially, they sacrificed some attacking threat in order to stop us creating, and it showed because the game didn't have many chances. But it also let them dominate midfield, and they were able to put more crosses in, and when they came in, there were more bodies in the middle.

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Re: Opening day Highlights vs Preston

Post by stainrod's elbow » Mon Aug 06, 2018 2:53 am

jimjams wrote:
Mon Aug 06, 2018 12:20 am
kernowhoop wrote:
Sun Aug 05, 2018 6:19 am
A 1-0 defeat at Preston is not the end of the world, but, the way that it happened raises a few questions.
I expected a better outcome. In my little dream world, I imagined that Eze and Osayi-Samuel (Freeman, too?) would be taking on Preston defenders in the way that they did against Union Berlin. I also thought that, after a while, they would get chopped down and we would benefit from free-kicks. I have no doubt that there is great talent in those players, so, the question is 'Why did they appear to present so little threat?' Steve McClaren seemed to allude to that after the game, when he talked of 'releasing the shackles'.
How do we 'release the shackles' ?
Well, I'll have a stab (ohers may disagree).

From clips it looks like Berlin played 442, which allows those players to find space in between the defence and midfield. Preston played a 4141, with Pearson up against Freeman. I thought Freeman played quite well, but the presence of Pearson meant he didn't have as much space and time on the ball, and also that it was more difficult for the players either side of him to link up with him. In addition, putting Pearson there meant the centrebacks can move back a bit more without having to worry too much about creating space between them and midfield. That means it's harder for Eze and Samuel to run in behind them, and easier for the full backs to push onto them, as the center of defence now has a spare man.
Then Luongo and Scowen have four men against them in midfield, which is normal (would be the same with a 442) but it's now harder for them to link with the players in front of them.
Essentially, they sacrificed some attacking threat in order to stop us creating, and it showed because the game didn't have many chances. But it also let them dominate midfield, and they were able to put more crosses in, and when they came in, there were more bodies in the middle.
It's stuff like this that brings me back to this board again and again. Fascinating take, Mr jimjams - thanks for that.
"There's a blue light/in my best friend's room" -Mazzy Star

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Re: Opening day Highlights vs Preston

Post by stainrod's elbow » Mon Aug 06, 2018 8:29 am

jimjams wrote:
Mon Aug 06, 2018 12:20 am
kernowhoop wrote:
Sun Aug 05, 2018 6:19 am
A 1-0 defeat at Preston is not the end of the world, but, the way that it happened raises a few questions.
I expected a better outcome. In my little dream world, I imagined that Eze and Osayi-Samuel (Freeman, too?) would be taking on Preston defenders in the way that they did against Union Berlin. I also thought that, after a while, they would get chopped down and we would benefit from free-kicks. I have no doubt that there is great talent in those players, so, the question is 'Why did they appear to present so little threat?' Steve McClaren seemed to allude to that after the game, when he talked of 'releasing the shackles'.
How do we 'release the shackles' ?
Well, I'll have a stab (ohers may disagree).

From clips it looks like Berlin played 442, which allows those players to find space in between the defence and midfield. Preston played a 4141, with Pearson up against Freeman. I thought Freeman played quite well, but the presence of Pearson meant he didn't have as much space and time on the ball, and also that it was more difficult for the players either side of him to link up with him. In addition, putting Pearson there meant the centrebacks can move back a bit more without having to worry too much about creating space between them and midfield. That means it's harder for Eze and Samuel to run in behind them, and easier for the full backs to push onto them, as the center of defence now has a spare man.
Then Luongo and Scowen have four men against them in midfield, which is normal (would be the same with a 442) but it's now harder for them to link with the players in front of them.
Essentially, they sacrificed some attacking threat in order to stop us creating, and it showed because the game didn't have many chances. But it also let them dominate midfield, and they were able to put more crosses in, and when they came in, there were more bodies in the middle.
Though this does raise the evident question - why didn't our manager anticipate this and/or do anything to change it before it was too late?
"There's a blue light/in my best friend's room" -Mazzy Star

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Re: Opening day Highlights vs Preston

Post by Esox Lucius » Mon Aug 06, 2018 9:15 am

stainrod's elbow wrote:
Mon Aug 06, 2018 8:29 am
jimjams wrote:
Mon Aug 06, 2018 12:20 am
kernowhoop wrote:
Sun Aug 05, 2018 6:19 am
A 1-0 defeat at Preston is not the end of the world, but, the way that it happened raises a few questions.
I expected a better outcome. In my little dream world, I imagined that Eze and Osayi-Samuel (Freeman, too?) would be taking on Preston defenders in the way that they did against Union Berlin. I also thought that, after a while, they would get chopped down and we would benefit from free-kicks. I have no doubt that there is great talent in those players, so, the question is 'Why did they appear to present so little threat?' Steve McClaren seemed to allude to that after the game, when he talked of 'releasing the shackles'.
How do we 'release the shackles' ?
Well, I'll have a stab (ohers may disagree).

From clips it looks like Berlin played 442, which allows those players to find space in between the defence and midfield. Preston played a 4141, with Pearson up against Freeman. I thought Freeman played quite well, but the presence of Pearson meant he didn't have as much space and time on the ball, and also that it was more difficult for the players either side of him to link up with him. In addition, putting Pearson there meant the centrebacks can move back a bit more without having to worry too much about creating space between them and midfield. That means it's harder for Eze and Samuel to run in behind them, and easier for the full backs to push onto them, as the center of defence now has a spare man.
Then Luongo and Scowen have four men against them in midfield, which is normal (would be the same with a 442) but it's now harder for them to link with the players in front of them.
Essentially, they sacrificed some attacking threat in order to stop us creating, and it showed because the game didn't have many chances. But it also let them dominate midfield, and they were able to put more crosses in, and when they came in, there were more bodies in the middle.
Though this does raise the evident question - why didn't our manager anticipate this and/or do anything to change it before it was too late? That's what Ian Holloway would've done for sure.
It's not the despair that will kill you, it's the hope.

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Re: Opening day Highlights vs Preston

Post by jimjams » Tue Aug 07, 2018 11:05 pm

stainrod's elbow wrote:
Mon Aug 06, 2018 8:29 am
Though this does raise the evident question - why didn't our manager anticipate this and/or do anything to change it before it was too late?
Should have responded earlier, but basically I don't know. I think it's worth bearing in mind that even though Preston had the edge, in terms of likelihood of scoring, the game wasn't very one-sided.
I don't think you can do it easily without a formation change (to 352? 442?) or at least changing players' roles. It was the first competitive match under McClaren, and in my eyes, the players on the pitch don't seem to have that much tactical maturity or flexibility in how they can play. So I'm not overly surprised he chose to stick rather than risk a big change.

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