Frustrating!

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n22hoop
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Re: Frustrating!

Post by n22hoop » Fri Sep 29, 2017 10:49 pm

dm wrote:
Fri Sep 29, 2017 10:32 pm
There were lots of things about tonight's performance and tactics we could debate but, for me, it's suffice to say we are a work in progress with quite a long way to go.

So, that we had the better of Fulham in the first half, if not the second, says a lot about this supposed best team in the Championship. Are they really? I doubt it.
Who says they're the best team in the Championship? I haven't read that anywhere or heard anyone say that. We lost to a mediocre team. Again!
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Re: Frustrating!

Post by westlondonlalala » Fri Sep 29, 2017 10:52 pm

dm wrote:
Fri Sep 29, 2017 10:32 pm
There were lots of things about tonight's performance and tactics we could debate but, for me, it's suffice to say we are a work in progress with quite a long way to go.

So, that we had the better of Fulham in the first half, if not the second, says a lot about this supposed best team in the Championship. Are they really? I doubt it.
There is no best team, Burton are struggling and beat Fulham the other week.

Cardiff don't play amazing free flowing footy but sit top, Leeds Fulham Villa can play attractive stuff but will they be there come May.

Ipswich & Preston are organised and sit in the playoffs yet Brentford & Derby both play Better footy than those two & are struggling.

Fulham like to keep possession & play it out from the back they like to counter attack hence they're results are better away from home than at home because teams come onto them.

The league is wide open not much on any given day between all 24 teams, you just need to tick all the boxes, we struggle to get it right for 90 mins consistently at the moment, we show glimpses but that's about it.

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Re: Frustrating!

Post by Systemsguy » Fri Sep 29, 2017 11:06 pm

Bear-Grills wrote:
Fri Sep 29, 2017 9:47 pm
Baptiste did OK for me. Lynch was very poor imo, my heart was in my mouth every time he was put under pressure - makes Onouha look like Beckenbauer. Smith didn't win a header all night after coming on.

Freeman our MoM by some distance, but I thought Scowen and Luongo were quite good as well.
I thought Baptiste had a decent match, Robinson is looking comfortable at CB (no nonsense boot to touch when needed) and felt most of the Fulham threat was down our left, Ojo was a real handful until he went off injured...

I suppose we see games differently from different parts of the ground I think...
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Re: Frustrating!

Post by RType » Sat Sep 30, 2017 2:28 am

We didn't really do enough to win. We battered them second half but don't recall their keeper making any kind of real save. The midfield 3 is clearly our strength but the rest of the team is lacking (smithies aside).

When/if all are fit I think a back three of onouha hall robsinson would be really good.

Up front is the clear problem. Good for Connor to get a goal, he is best suited to our system but really needs to put more of his chances away (how long have we been saying that)

Fulham were decent. They have a clear style of play and obviously very dangerous on the break. Dirty team though, lots of niggly tactical fouls. I can't see them going up though, both these teams will still be in the same division next year.

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Re: Frustrating!

Post by Devonranger » Sat Sep 30, 2017 6:35 am

Fair assessment RType - we didn't have that pace or guile in the attacking third to make our opportunities really count.

Thought some of our build up play looked pretty good in places - some nice one and two touch play.

Fredericks, Johansen, Mollo, Sessegnon, Ojo, Norwood, MacDonald, Odoi - all of them committed at least one or more of those tactical fouls stopping a Rangers player heading towards the penalty area or in Mackie's case a counter attack on the break - pretty much the whole Fulham team barring goalie and centre halves.

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Re: Frustrating!

Post by Esox Lucius » Sat Sep 30, 2017 7:29 am

I thought Sylla had his best game for us last night, and it really became obvious when Matt Smith came on the gap in quality between the two of them. It was a shame that he was not getting the service in areas where it could hurt Fulham. Wszolek looks like he is off form rther than no good as his defensive work was good and I wonder if he was under instructions to not take on players in case he loses the ball and sets up a Fulham counter attack, it certainly seemed that way from the way he was playing last night.
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Re: Frustrating!

Post by westlondonlalala » Sat Sep 30, 2017 7:49 am

Esox Lucius wrote:
Sat Sep 30, 2017 7:29 am
I thought Sylla had his best game for us last night, and it really became obvious when Matt Smith came on the gap in quality between the two of them. It was a shame that he was not getting the service in areas where it could hurt Fulham. Wszolek looks like he is off form rther than no good as his defensive work was good and I wonder if he was under instructions to not take on players in case he loses the ball and sets up a Fulham counter attack, it certainly seemed that way from the way he was playing last night.
Wow that is a first, instructing a winger not to take on a defender incase he loses the ball.. what planet do you actually live on..

Sylla was shite didn't have a shot on target hardly got involved & as usual spent more time on the deck feigning injury.

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Re: Frustrating!

Post by Bear-Grills » Sat Sep 30, 2017 7:56 am

westlondonlalala wrote:
Sat Sep 30, 2017 7:49 am
Esox Lucius wrote:
Sat Sep 30, 2017 7:29 am
I thought Sylla had his best game for us last night, and it really became obvious when Matt Smith came on the gap in quality between the two of them. It was a shame that he was not getting the service in areas where it could hurt Fulham. Wszolek looks like he is off form rther than no good as his defensive work was good and I wonder if he was under instructions to not take on players in case he loses the ball and sets up a Fulham counter attack, it certainly seemed that way from the way he was playing last night.
Wow that is a first, instructing a winger not to take on a defender incase he loses the ball.. what planet do you actually live on..

Sylla was shite didn't have a shot on target hardly got involved & as usual spent more time on the deck feigning injury.
I think EL was speculating about Woz rather than stating it as a fact and, to be honest, I've been wondering myself if he was under orders to be more defensive minded -not easy for an attack minded player- when going forward. Sylla did ok I reckon, and he was clearly better than Smith, who ran around to no discernible effect and I don't think won a header all night. I can recall Sylla going down three times, only one of which I thought where he was laying it on. Clearly though, none of our forwards are good enough - give Wheeler a decent run out!
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Re: Frustrating!

Post by westlondonlalala » Sat Sep 30, 2017 7:58 am

Bear-Grills wrote:
Sat Sep 30, 2017 7:56 am
westlondonlalala wrote:
Sat Sep 30, 2017 7:49 am
Esox Lucius wrote:
Sat Sep 30, 2017 7:29 am
I thought Sylla had his best game for us last night, and it really became obvious when Matt Smith came on the gap in quality between the two of them. It was a shame that he was not getting the service in areas where it could hurt Fulham. Wszolek looks like he is off form rther than no good as his defensive work was good and I wonder if he was under instructions to not take on players in case he loses the ball and sets up a Fulham counter attack, it certainly seemed that way from the way he was playing last night.
Wow that is a first, instructing a winger not to take on a defender incase he loses the ball.. what planet do you actually live on..

Sylla was shite didn't have a shot on target hardly got involved & as usual spent more time on the deck feigning injury.
I think EL was speculating about Woz rather than stating it as a fact and, to be honest, I've been wondering myself if he was under orders to be more defensive minded -not easy for an attack minded player- when going forward. Sylla did ok I reckon, and he was clearly better than Smith, who ran around to no discernible effect and I don't think won a header all night. I can recall Sylla going down three times, only one of which I thought where he was laying it on. Clearly though, none of our forwards are good enough - give Wheeler a decent run out!
To even think a manager would instruct a winger not to attack is quite frankly beyond belief, we played Fulham not Real Madrid.

At times we had 9 players in there half we were left exposed on a number of occasions at the back, if that team was instructed to defend & not attack then they clearly didn't listen to the brief.

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Re: Frustrating!

Post by Stans left foot » Sat Sep 30, 2017 8:08 am

If ever proof were needed that comments gets skewed and reasoning goes out the window:
[/Smith didn't win a header all night after coming on.
quote]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but just how did Washington receive the ball to score?

Calm down dear, calm down.
"Fing Poo Wah" ( your comments are as much interest to me as a dogs fart ).

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Re: Frustrating!

Post by Bear-Grills » Sat Sep 30, 2017 8:10 am

westlondonlalala wrote:
Sat Sep 30, 2017 7:58 am
Bear-Grills wrote:
Sat Sep 30, 2017 7:56 am
westlondonlalala wrote:
Sat Sep 30, 2017 7:49 am


Wow that is a first, instructing a winger not to take on a defender incase he loses the ball.. what planet do you actually live on..

Sylla was shite didn't have a shot on target hardly got involved & as usual spent more time on the deck feigning injury.
I think EL was speculating about Woz rather than stating it as a fact and, to be honest, I've been wondering myself if he was under orders to be more defensive minded -not easy for an attack minded player- when going forward. Sylla did ok I reckon, and he was clearly better than Smith, who ran around to no discernible effect and I don't think won a header all night. I can recall Sylla going down three times, only one of which I thought where he was laying it on. Clearly though, none of our forwards are good enough - give Wheeler a decent run out!
To even think a manager would instruct a winger not to attack is quite frankly beyond belief, we played Fulham not Real Madrid.

At times we had 9 players in there half we were left exposed on a number of occasions at the back, if that team was instructed to defend & not attack then they clearly didn't listen to the brief.
I don't suppose he did instruct that, but if he's also trying to get Woz to think more about defence -which is feasible- I think you have to let an attacking player attack first and foremost. Our players aren't good enough to ask them to multi-task - let them do what they are good at and let defenders defend. I agree we weren't concentrating on defence in the second half, but we were chasing it, and we always look that frantic when we're chasing it and leave big gaps at the back - like against Millwall even though they were down to 10. Doesn't matter how much chasing and pressuring we do though if no one can stick the ball in the net :(
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Re: Frustrating!

Post by westlondonlalala » Sat Sep 30, 2017 8:17 am

Bear-Grills wrote:
Sat Sep 30, 2017 8:10 am
westlondonlalala wrote:
Sat Sep 30, 2017 7:58 am
Bear-Grills wrote:
Sat Sep 30, 2017 7:56 am


I think EL was speculating about Woz rather than stating it as a fact and, to be honest, I've been wondering myself if he was under orders to be more defensive minded -not easy for an attack minded player- when going forward. Sylla did ok I reckon, and he was clearly better than Smith, who ran around to no discernible effect and I don't think won a header all night. I can recall Sylla going down three times, only one of which I thought where he was laying it on. Clearly though, none of our forwards are good enough - give Wheeler a decent run out!
To even think a manager would instruct a winger not to attack is quite frankly beyond belief, we played Fulham not Real Madrid.

At times we had 9 players in there half we were left exposed on a number of occasions at the back, if that team was instructed to defend & not attack then they clearly didn't listen to the brief.
I don't suppose he did instruct that, but if he's also trying to get Woz to think more about defence -which is feasible- I think you have to let an attacking player attack first and foremost. Our players aren't good enough to ask them to multi-task - let them do what they are good at and let defenders defend. I agree we weren't concentrating on defence in the second half, but we were chasing it, and we always look that frantic when we're chasing it and leave big gaps at the back - like against Millwall even though they were down to 10. Doesn't matter how much chasing and pressuring we do though if no one can stick the ball in the net :(
Like I said Bear on another thread, Freeman is our main man play and build the team around him, we have strikers that don't score & the points are drying up, like you say change it up get Wheeler in the team & try something different coz it's looking rather stale at present.

Two week break now anyway plenty of time for Ollie to work on things shifty

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Re: Frustrating!

Post by dm » Sat Sep 30, 2017 8:33 am

Stans left foot wrote:
Sat Sep 30, 2017 8:08 am
If ever proof were needed that comments gets skewed and reasoning goes out the window:
[/Smith didn't win a header all night after coming on.
quote]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but just how did Washington receive the ball to score?

Calm down dear, calm down.
You're correct SLF as the highlights show. The stats have Smith winning 7 headers in the 30 minutes he was on.

That said, I am in the Sylla over Smith camp and believe we'll only really see what Sylla is capable of when he's given a run of games.

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Re: Frustrating!

Post by Bear-Grills » Sat Sep 30, 2017 8:41 am

dm wrote:
Sat Sep 30, 2017 8:33 am
Stans left foot wrote:
Sat Sep 30, 2017 8:08 am
If ever proof were needed that comments gets skewed and reasoning goes out the window:
[/Smith didn't win a header all night after coming on.
quote]

Correct me if I'm wrong, but just how did Washington receive the ball to score?

Calm down dear, calm down.
You're correct SLF as the highlights show. The stats have Smith winning 7 headers in the 30 minutes he was on.

That said, I am in the Sylla over Smith camp and believe we'll only really see what Sylla is capable of when he's given a run of games.
Can't argue with stats I suppose. Did any of his headers go anywhere useful apart from the Washington one (which I missed due to the stanchion in Ellersie)
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Re: Frustrating!

Post by dm » Sat Sep 30, 2017 8:47 am

Bear-Grills wrote:
Sat Sep 30, 2017 8:41 am
dm wrote:
Sat Sep 30, 2017 8:33 am
Stans left foot wrote:
Sat Sep 30, 2017 8:08 am
If ever proof were needed that comments gets skewed and reasoning goes out the window:



You're correct SLF as the highlights show. The stats have Smith winning 7 headers in the 30 minutes he was on.

That said, I am in the Sylla over Smith camp and believe we'll only really see what Sylla is capable of when he's given a run of games.
Can't argue with stats I suppose. Did any of his headers go anywhere useful apart from the Washington one (which I missed due to the stanchion in Ellersie)
A good question BG which I don't have a definitive answer to - but suspect not really. For a man standing 6' 6" high you'd expect him to do better in the air than he does. He's okay facing goal but surprisingly bad with his back to goal.

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